Post-Election Thread

Prop 8 wasn't even the only one, it was just the only one that got media attention. Gay marriage was shot down independently in every state it was voted on in. Arizona, California, and Florida. And in Arkansas Gay Couples were banned from even adopting children.
 
That's true, but I think it's purpose was designed to prevent gay people from adopting specifically because Arkansas does not recognize same sex marriage. Most political websites that list results for ballot initiatives show this one as "Arkansas Initiative 1: Ban on Gay Couples Adopting Children" and then only as a footnote mention that there is text in the legislation that it applies to straight couples as well.
 
Yeah I agree that it was designed for it but even still. I know some older women who are single who adopted and have done a great job raising thier adopted child. So making it that you have to be married to adopt doesn't just effect gay couples.
 
Razorcat said:
I think everyone first heard about Obama back in 2004. I wasn't interested in Obama until after reading to his book "Audacity of Hope." And strangely enough, I believed in his book and his message of change. Unfortunately, change is something that is hard to implement because Washington does not like change when change can lead you unemployed. Now that he's president elect, it'll be interesting how he tries to implement change.

Some of the questions I keep asking myself were:
1. Why do I care about "winning the war" in Iraq? McCain stressed this a few times. Its a war that should never have been declared.

Why can't we (as a nation) win the war against obesity? Or win the war against AIDS? Or win the war against cancer? Or even... win the war against declining educational test scores compared to other industrialized nations? These issues in my opinion should be more central to the discussion on making US great.

2. Why should I care about foreign policy experience? I don't. I find this issue to be pretty ridiculous. Look at Bush/Cheney. They have probably one of the better foreign policy experience compared to Gore and Kerry and what did they do? Declare war against Iraq. A war... that is from what I've heard... our era's Vietnam war.

3. Where has the American Dream gone? With so many people losing their homes and with the economy as it is, how will/can US remain strong. I certainly hope Obama's legacy will be to establish a strong foundation for the economy where anyone's American dream can come true.

4. Finally, Why is the religious right so active in politics? I still believe in separation of church and state but these days I think that line is becoming very thin.
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Unfortunately for most Americans winning the war on "paying my mortgage" or "affording to put my kids through college" makes most of middle America turn conservative or right in their ideology on a day to day level. However, a bad economy can swing it back to the left in a heartbeat for what reasons I have not been able to figure out...

While I myself share your ideas, there is a limited place for what is commonly and unfairly labeled as liberalism or leftist ideology. Most are seen as college students or people who know nothing about the struggle to raise a family and make it day to day in America. These people usually flock to urban areas and we have what is sadly resembling a culture war in America. Its like if you believe in a cause you are wrong because in the end people worry about the bottom line... and that is "Sounds great, but who is going to pay for it?" Personally I believe we all pay for America to improve itself so we can live in a better place... yea? However, such views might have somebody like Rush Limbaugh infer that I was a commie pig or something... lol

As far as the war in Iraq. While I strongly oppose the war. The "Bush Doctrine" is extremely fascinating, in the sense that if he carried it out in a better fashion (not lie and coerce the public) and it was actually successful (not get bogged down in Iraq) he would have gone down in history as one of the most important and influential presidents of ours or any other time...

That is the crazy part... that he was so dead set that his idea would work that he risked thousands of lives and billions of dollars to prove his theory... It was a gamble that turned to be a disastrous miscalculation... its like shooting a 3 pointer in basketball when you were only down by 1 point. It was as if he abandoned any contingency or alternative plan on how to fight terrorism because of his belief in the design of his plan. Some people accuse him of being a moron (which in some cases he really is) but I think hes just a guy who attempted what he thought would be the game winning shot and missed and we all payed for it... the real question is who drew up the play to take that shot?

As far as the religious right is concerned... um... Lets keep religion out of politics. Policy is made to protect human rights and as long as religious view opposes certain ways of life, then it has no business in government. While these people have every legal right to think or practice their views and religion any way they want then its apparent to me at least, that it remain solely in the private sector of peoples lives.

Dar~
 
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To Ehon- I moved to nashville, there is no escaping lol. i think it is redder down here honstly lol.

-ara
 
I voted for pitlith arafea im disappointed they didnt win
 
thank you for your vote. i thought we had a shot in penn but alas...

-ara
 
Sadly, Nashville was one of just a few that actually went Blue last night. It is in a crimson sea of Red though. I guess most everyone else in TN didn't see what Nashville saw.
 
GOD DAMMIT... stupid timeout feature... I had a long reply to but it got lost after i had to relog back in. Why do some forums when pressing the back button remember things that were typed while others don't?

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I think the main thing I wanted to state was:

These "war on obesity" etc that I mentioned... I do not think should be considered liberalistic or leftist. I believe they are central in how US will develop in the future and should be addressed today. They are more than anything, a concern about the future.
 
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To Kalia's comment about most Japanese don't even know who Palin is. How many Americans do you think can name a member of a foreign government? Without the help of Google that is.
 
I suppose I'll chime in here with a different outlook and hope I don't end up alienating myself. :P I grew up in a very conservative household and have voted along those lines on most occasions. This election I was torn. I feel many of Obama's proposed policies are not good ideas, and that McCain's more closely matched what should be done. On the other hand, I strongly felt that McCain would be more of the same old politics in Washington that I dislike so much, and that Obama would try to change that. I ended up with the feeling that Obama's governing style would be different and a much needed change, even though I feel many of his social programs and such are not good ideas.

In the end, it really didn't matter which way I voted, because Oklahoma was going to go for McCain strongly. :P So I'll leave it up in the air as to the direction I actually voted. I'm not sorry to see Obama in office, and I hope he can bring about good change for the country.

My fear is that with both houses of Congress in Democratic hands along with a Democratic president, the politicians will once again indulge themselves and do all they can to grab federal money for their states. We have a budget problem, and increased taxes alone will not fix it (not to mention the slowing effect higher taxes have on the economy).

The goal of Congress is to make the best choices for the nation, not try to get as big a slice of the budget for their state that they can. It irks me to no end that when the Republicans last got both houses and the presidency, they left their "small government" ideals behind and spent money left and right. It's good for their state and good for their reelection campaigns, but taken all together it's horrible for the country. So what happens now that the "larger government" party has control? I fear they will do more of the same when we seriously as a nation need to control our expenditures. Our deficit won't go away by itself.

So I really do hope Obama's presidency does lead to change. I think he will try hard to make the country better, but I don't know if he can stand against the weight of DC bureaucracy and congressional greed.

Here's hoping! ^_^b
 
Varda said:
Here's hoping! ^_^b
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Yes. We're all hoping.

Now that I'm home... onto recalling my long post.

Re: Religious Right
I think Prop 8 in California is a veiled attempt of the religious right forcing the issue to the voters and then stating it was the "people's will" that it passed/failed. In my opinion, Prop 8 as its written limits the freedom of a particular group of individuals (gays/lesbians). Restricting such freedom goes against the doctrine and philosophical basis of the Bill of Rights. Gay/Lesbian marriage neither oppresses people nor restricts the freedom of others.

The religious right however has slowly introduced legislation such as Prop 8 in order to oppress people who have differing religious views. So ironic isn't it? America was founded on freedom from religious persecution as well as freedom to worship whatever... and here we are in 2000 years later... religious zealots people persecuting others because zealots can't stand to have other people not believe in their own beliefs.

Another thing that religious people have slowly introduced is banning evolutionary theory while introducing their own "creationism" theory aka intelligent design. I don't mind introduction of intelligent design, but to ban evolutionary theory at the same time however is just another form of oppression.
 
Pussenboots said:
To Kalia's comment about most Japanese don't even know who Palin is. How many Americans do you think can name a member of a foreign government? Without the help of Google that is.
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Nickolas Sarkozy, Vladimir Putin, Mahmoud Ahmendjin....

Trust me google stayed out of that one
 
Varda said:
In the end, it really didn't matter which way I voted, because Oklahoma was going to go for McCain strongly. :P So I'll leave it up in the air as to the direction I actually voted. I'm not sorry to see Obama in office, and I hope he can bring about good change for the country.
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The Director of my movie's brother ran for State Senate in Oklahoma... and lost... :weeping01

Id assume you didnt vote for him!!!!!!
 
To my more conservative friends, i would not worry to much. I honestly do not believe President Obama is going to alienate you guys like Bush did to us Dems. He is going to have a very centralist cabinet, your ideas will be represented. Yes, dems do hold congress and some of the ideas we have will not always sit well with you. But honestly, you guys had the country in the palm of your hand. and what came of it? the largest growth of government since FDR. i truely do not believe we will grow the government like Bush did. So, i understand your worries but atleast give him a chance. And it is very good to see that alot are willing to do so. Only time will tell. One last point, the world is celebrating this election, that does mean something. maybe we can finnally get the world to work with us again.

-ara
 
I recently heard Tom DeLey make a comment of how Nancy Pelosi was going to "run circles around Obama"...

I personally dont see that happening, Barack us too strong willed and tactical to allow her to control the government and she would be a complete retard to oppose one of the most popular members of her own party, who happens to be the head of the executive branch they have been bitching about for the last 8 years.... a bit of a stalemate, if you will

I believe they will act a lot more reserved in their decisions so not to fall prey to public scrutiny and right wing prognostication.

Dont get me wrong they will push their agenda at times... but in no way will this "Government of 3" bullshit you hear from the right wing play out so overtly. my opinion at least... hope they dont prove me wrong :confused: heh
 
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