a word about neg

furax

furax

Chikubi
FC/Leadership
I hope you people don't seriously believe that neg stole some items from some supposedly random people and sold them or that he even attempted to MPK anyone in sky. Those are pretty much blatant lies and I'd love for whoever said those things to admit to it. He's one of the few people I know that actually spends weeks farming to buy items. He sure as HELL has alot more integrity than some of us. The only "reason" that has any validity is he is argumentative.
Besides that, he's helped you all out quite a bit in an effort to warm up to everyone and it's total bullshit that he's been mislabeled. So much for finding the right people for the linkshell, let alone the right jobs.
 
That's one of the problems with being in the endgame scene. Once you've been around for some time, your whole ingame future is pretty much decided, and if there's one person somewhere that doesn't like you they can just make stuff or spread false rumors.

Can we see some basis/evidence supporting these stolen items and/or MPKs?
 
I like Neg, I didn't even think there was going to be a problem getting his app put up. He's a very active participant, has a useful job, and I've never had a bad vibe from him either ingame or after reading a forum post. This situation reminds me of a few other people.

Neg looks like someone I would love to have as a shellmate. If anything did happen in the past, I really would like a few specific examples. It seems to be what is holding him back and I've personally never heard or witnessed anything bad about him.
 
i'd agree here with what furax and arch are saying, the only negative side to negative... lol ...is that he is a forum troll, but hell.. so are a lot of people. Doesnt make them bad players/people.
 
Even if neg is a good guy or not, and in my eyes hes an ok guy; people in the shell are holding some sort of resentment/s towards him, be it based on truth or fiction its still there and its probably enough to just get enough No votes when hes put up.
 
Well two ppl "outside the LS" said he stole/sold something but who cares (I didnt know we looked for outside advise when putting someone up for vote - but Im sure you have a better idea of what your doing then I would)... Im sure he will find a LS at some point. I think Furax is just frustrated because he has known him for close to 10 years in real life. They are best friends and I believe Furax has a better grasp on his Negs intentions and character then most. (not his ffxi character, his real character.) But if you want to believe someone who heard that someone said something about him on ffxi then so be it.
 
Well, I just kind of view it as the same as that incident with the "Dirty Bomber" who was supposedly going to release some dirty bomb on the subways and kill everyone, and the DoJ took him into custody without any evidence, wouldnt' tell anyone why he was taken into custody, woudlnt' let him talk to a lawyer, wouldn't let him appeal his case, wouldnt' tell anyone what their evidence was, and basically that was the end of it. Maybe these accusations are perfectly valid, but that's what I'd like to know, and withholding that information seems to be an injustice to all parties involved.
 
As much as I would like to see Negative in the shell this goes back to the entire reason why this information gets sent via PM to Fodder. Because no matter whether it should be kept within the LS or not SOMEONE always goes & blabs every bit of it to outsiders, their friends, w/e.

If the entire LS could be trusted to keep their mouths shut about applicants then this wouldn't be neccesary & maybe more could be said, but past experience shows it can't be.

That being said, Fodder said in his post that enough people had sent him PMs stating why they did not want Neg in the shell, which is their right as LS members, and Fodder looked at their reasons as valid. People rehash this same concern every single time an applicant is denied who they want to see in.
 
Well, to me at least it isn't so much a matter of whether or not people have opinions of people. "He seems very argumentative and not easy to get along with." That's an opinion. "He stole a bunch of shit and sold it and pocketed the money." That's not an opinion, it's either a fact or a false accusation. If it's a fact, there should be some evidence supporting it. If it's a false accusation, that should be determined and any comments regarding stolen items should be discarded from consideration.

Personally I dont' care who PMed Fodder with these concerns, but when accusations are made, I'd like to see some evidence. Otherwise all of our member applications will boil down to : You will get into Ultima if there is nobody in Ultima who wants to sabotage your application.

Edit: Before anyone says I just lke him and am upset because he didn't get in, I should mention I dont' even know him aside from having the same linkshell on while doing DynamisX from time to time. But I do like to see fairness exercised, and knowing how the endgame drama scene is in FFXI, I like to see evidence supporting any kind of accusations around people. If the people who submitted such comments to Fodder truly know that these things happened, they shoudl be able to give names. e.g. "he stole item _______ from the character with the name ________, feel free to ask the victim about the incident"
 
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Lets keep all arguments to within Talking points please (;'-')

I hate reading about everyones life story when they argue a point ('-'*)
 
It honestly doesnt bother Furax or myself that he didnt get in. We just dont like to see his name get slandered because someone said he did this or that. WE have known him in real life for years. Not computer life or /tell life of ffxi. Hell, if we were to ever get married he would probably be the best man. Its our natural reaction to defend our real life friend. Sorry for the posts and crap. But in any case lets just drop it for now.
 
I do have "he borrowed X items from Y person, then kept/sold them", which essentially is stealing. Where possible I followed up with the parties involved. I am not going to get into who said what, or who X people were. That would violate my promise of people being able to come to me with their reasoning on why they feel an app should not join the LS without fear of retribution. That is exactly what happened multiple times in the past and why we do it this way now. What little I did say in a private forum was shared with Neg - had I said more I presume it would also have been related back. There is no secret tribunal or witch hunt I conduct. I simply do my best to evaluate what is said to me, corroborate or discount it where possible, and go from there. As I've stated in the past, a "No vote" doesn't count unless I feel there is sufficient justification for it. For each and every no, I contact the person who said no and ask for justification. Many of you have voted no on various apps and can attest to the fact that I follow up with you as to why and then I make the why known to the LS as well as I can without compromising the who.

I spoke with Neg and a few other people regarding this, and I understand various people's concerns. In light of who PMd me with reasoning I can assure you there is no conspiracy here. I am sorry to say that no amount of discussion will change the outcome of this application. If you are friends with Neg I would hope you would not let this affect said friendship. Neg has indicated that it does not from his perspective.
 
Is there any evidence beyond he said/she said to prove that neg stole anything? I highly doubt it. I call horseshit. It's a shame the panel can pass judgement by purely circumstantial evidence. Want me to conjur up 5-10 people who said ANYONE stole something? No problem, I'll have them tell you that even I stole something, just because I fucking asked. There's something seriously flawed here.
 
Garret said:
If the entire LS could be trusted to keep their mouths shut about applicants then this wouldn't be neccesary & maybe more could be said, but past experience shows it can't be.
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We can all add, Garret, and I dont like your style of math.

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In another note: Dont mince words. Say what you have to say, good or bad and people will respect you for your opinion regardless of if they believe it or not. Its why we arent communists. And one thing is for sure, if you never share reasons to defend your stance, people will never know them. so when you do throw out your main point it will be without support and you will fail.

And, I would like to think that if a linkshell member has an opinion on a serious (or as serious as a game can be) matter, we would, as a linkshell be able to respect his opinion no matter how inane it might be.

Granted I dont know anything about NegativePositive other than his application, but I think people (mainly his friends) also have a right to know what is going on behind the scenes.
 
Ashmus said:
Say what you have to say, good or bad and people will respect you for your opinion regardless of if they believe it or not. Its why we arent communists.
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lol
 
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